Tactical Tips for Balancing Work & Breastfeeding w/ Jillian from MAMMaway

Join us in this empowering episode as we explore practical strategies and gain confidence in sustainably balancing work and breastfeeding. Our guest, Jillian Rothe, Founder & CEO of MAMMaway, shares valuable insights and advice to help you navigate these challenges with ease.

Learn how to confidently approach different scenarios, from TSA interactions during travel to communicating your needs at work! From fear to practical planning, dive into the essential logistics of your breastfeeding journey while managing work commitments, and discover recent laws protecting your right to pump and advocate for yourself.

You'll also hear inspiring success stories of women who have triumphed in balancing work and breastfeeding-- having both a career and long-term breastfeeding journey is possible!

Unlock the knowledge and tools to bring your liquid gold from point A to point B, all while nurturing your baby and pursuing your career. For practical guidance and inspiration, don't miss this must-listen episode!


About Jillian & MAMMaway:
"With an early diagnosis of endometriosis as a teenager, Jillian was told it was unlikely that she’d be able to have children, so she pivoted away from her plans of mothering and spent her 20s focusing on her career and traveling the world. While living in Singapore with her partner and working in a heavily male-dominated industry with extreme travel requirements, Jillian and her partner were given the blessing and surprise of getting pregnant. But with that came a major problem: finding a way to store enough milk for her week-long business trips without the bags breaking in the freezer and going to waste. That was what sparked the development of the Freeze-It-Flat (and MAMMaway)!"

Contact Info for Jillian/MAMMaway:

• IG: @mammaway 
• Shop and learn more on the MAMMaway Website (affiliate link)

Additional Resources:

• Legal Protections to Pump at Work 

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Transcript

Katie Kurpanek: 0:06

You're listening to all things sustainable, where we unpack topics related to sustainable living, as well as how to apply specific actions to your own life. I'm your eco living coach and podcast host Katie Kurpanek. Let's jump in. Hello, everybody. Welcome back to season four of the All Things sustainable podcast. I am so happy that you are here. And I hope you've been enjoying this series so far on eco minded parenting and caretaking. We kicked it off last time with the episode with Dana, the hypnotherapist and Hypno birthing coach. And her episode was so phenomenal what a way to kick off this series just talking about right from the beginning of a lot of people's parenthood journey talking about birth. The Hypno birthing section of that episode was so empowering. And then also she spends probably 50% of the episode talking about hypnotherapy in general, which is beneficial to any person anywhere. So I highly recommend that you go back and take a listen if you haven't already. But today we are continuing with the series talking with Jillian, the founder and CEO of MAMMaway, we are going to be diving deep into what it looks like to have a sustainable breastfeeding journey. Now we do acknowledge in the episode that everybody's feeding journeys are different with your family, you need to just do whatever is best for your family, of course, and we support all of that. If there are any of you listening, and breastfeeding is really important to you. And that is something that you want to be a part of your journey with your family, then this episode is for you. And you can definitely sustain your breastfeeding journey. With a career with other aspects of your life that are so busy, you definitely don't have to give that up if that is important to you. So that is what this episode is all about. Jillian has so many pro pumping tips, pro breastfeeding tips, all of it while pumping is breastfeeding. So pro nursing pro pumping. And all of her tips are incredible. It helps you to manage and alleviate your stress. And that of course is going to help your milk supply. So you definitely want to give this episode a listen. I am going to stop talking get right into it. But first I'm going to give you just one sort of a heads up on terminology. And then also two little plugs. So first with terminology, I am always learning more watching my language trying to be as inclusive as possible with this podcast and my whole life really. And part of what we're doing in this episode to to remain inclusive is really focusing on using words that focus on the parent. And then of course with breastfeeding, you know the parent with the mammaries. And that is how MAMMaway also got its name. So when the mammaries are away, MAMMaway has created tools to support parenting and breastfeeding. And so that is where the name comes from. But sometimes throughout the episode though terms, you know, mama or a woman or man or partner, you know those terms are going to be used when talking about parenting and breastfeeding. But for the most part, we are trying to just be as neutral and inclusive as possible, speaking only to the parents with the mammaries, whatever that looks like for you. So one that's that's your one heads up on terminology. And then two quick plugs before we dive into the conversation. So if you are loving what you learn in this conversation, and you want to take advantage of the tools that Jillian has created and engineered to support your breastfeeding experience, they are amazing. And there's so many of them. You can find all of those at her website, which will be linked in the show notes. But also you will get exclusive discounts just for being a listener of this podcast if you join our Patreon community. So you'll learn more about Patreon. Later in the episode, it's a chance to become a patron supporter of the show. And by doing that, you know even for as low as $3 a month, then you have access to a whole variety of perks and one of those perks is getting discounts to all of my community partners and Jillian with MAMMaway is one of them. So if you want exclusive discounts to any of her products, you will be able to access that. Okay, the final plug that I'm going to throw in here really quick is something that I just got set up. I'm very excited about it. I set up an account for anybody to become an affiliate with my video courses. So if you've been around for a while you know that That Minimal Life is like the umbrella term for everything that I do with sustainable coaching and this podcast is part of that. So that minimal life.com is where you can find a bunch of video courses and support for living sustainably and more in depth. You know things like composting 101 or zero waste 101 You know how to live sustainably on a budget all of these different things. And if those video courses have benefited your life in any way and you want to know Not only support other people by promoting those video courses, but you would also like to have the opportunity to earn 10% Of all the sales made on those video courses through your own affiliate link. Now you can do that. So everything that you need to sign up and become an affiliate for that minimal life is in the show notes, the episode description, you can click that and join our community of affiliates. Thank you so much for listening. There you go. That's all I have for you. Let's go ahead and dive right into all the amazing content that Jillian has to share with you and support your sustainable breastfeeding journey. Jillian, I am super thrilled to have you on the podcast. Thank you so much for being here with us today, we are going to be covering a lot of exciting stuff today, we're mainly going to be focusing on balancing like a sustainable breastfeeding work life balance, and how you created MAMMaway to help with that. So I'm very excited to get into it. I've told my listeners a little bit about you in the introduction. But I would love if they could just hear from your own words like a little about yourself, who you are, what you're passionate about, and who are some of the beloved people in your life.

Jillian Rothe: 6:15

I love it. So first of all, thank you for having me. This is fun. I love the you're a great human and I'm excited to sit down have a conversation with you.

Katie Kurpanek: 6:23

Oh, thank you!

Jillian Rothe: 6:24

But yeah, so my name is Jillian. I am the founder of MAMMaway. Also, if you see in my I think it's my email signature and some other things. It's I'm the chief mom, engineering and Lactivist. And so the people in my life that make that happen are I've got three small humans that I'm responsible for raising, they are eight, six, and four. Evelyn and Braden were born in Singapore, August is our Colorado native. So I've got the little sticker. And then my, my partner Steve, is is also a working half of this whole hot mess that we're trying to run. And he's amazing, wonderfully supportive of me and of my family. And it's just been really fun building it and, and so we started MAMMaway kind of on accident, is, you know, engineers that solve their own problem. And maybe we'll get into that a little bit. But we're accidental entrepreneurs. And so we wanted to create something for when the mammaries have to be away. And our first product is a device to freeze breast milk differently.

Katie Kurpanek: 7:27

So I love all of that. I love it so much that everything about your story. And also, I always appreciate a good clever title. And the way that you've done that with MAMMaway is brilliant. I love it so much.

Jillian Rothe: 7:41

And the best part of I sit in and you know, for those watching video, like what I'm sitting in on, like investor conversations, or entrepreneurial kind of things, it's like when the mammaries are away, and I actually get to grab my boobs in like a professional setting, which just keeps it fun. Make sure I get the point across.

Katie Kurpanek: 7:57

Yeah, yeah, just in case they missed it.

Jillian Rothe: 7:59

Exactly. I have your attention now. Good. Let's go.

Katie Kurpanek: 8:03

Oh, my gosh, that's so great. I am so excited to get into this with you. I also love everything on your Instagram. Like if people haven't already been following you on Instagram, they need to go find MAMMaway right now. Well, maybe finish listening to this conversation and then go do that because you post such helpful tips and tricks for like pumping, and just managing breast milk storage. And so we're definitely gonna get into more of that in this episode as well. But I feel like your Instagram is so accessible. So in this season, you know, the season of the podcast that we're in, we're in season four, and we're talking about eco minded parenting and caretaking. And this is exactly why I wanted to have you on the podcast because you have such a wonderful perspective to bring to the table. You like you said you're a self titled you know mama engineer and Lactivist, which I love that play on words as well. And you've created MAMMaway to support parents so that they don't have to choose, you know, their their career over breastfeeding, if that's not something that they want. So I know you stated this many times before, in your website and everything that you do, but everyone's breastfeeding journey and parenting journey is different and their own. And there's never any shame that comes along with, like what you created or what we're going to talk about today. What you've created with MAMMaway is just an incredible tool to empower people if they want to continue their breastfeeding journey and have a work, you know, balance as well. So I'm gonna stop talking there because I feel like you do such a better job of getting into this. This is what you do for a living. But could you tell us a little bit more about ma'am away like what have you created with this company? And how does this impact and empower parents in order to like, live sustainably, both for the environment and for their own professional or personal sanity.

Jillian Rothe: 10:01

Yeah, you said so many things. And if I can, like if I can remember half of the things that you said,

Katie Kurpanek: 10:06

oh sorry, I threw so much at you ha ha

Jillian Rothe: 10:09

if when I forget something just remind me that I forgot to say something. But yeah, thank you for the Instagram piece that's been a fun thing like growing a business. And learning how to be a better millennial and post on Instagram has been super fun. So like, I would love the engagement in the comments of like, what in here is fun for you? But yeah, that's been super great. My kids love it too. But the like creating MAMMaway, I think it was. It was mostly I think we were talking on the internet, like I became an entrepreneur on accident. And I never really intended to do this. But it turns out with the, the experience, we were handed living in Singapore, where our older two were born, and I was back at work at eight weeks and five weeks, and just some of the banks right. And so going back to work in a corporate fortune 50 company where I've got to be on a plane all over Asia for a week at a time. We had to figure out like, I never really thought about using formula, it was just the bubble I was in is between my mom and my doulas and whoever else, you know, "you've got enough for the whole neighborhood, you'll be fine." So I never questioned it. And so when I had to be on a plane, it was a question of logistics. Okay, how am I going to bring a cooler? How am I going to fit enough at home? How am I going to make sure my nanny and my husband know, like, how to use breast milk. And so that's where it kind of came in, we were just solving our own problem and, and fast forward. You know, a few years later, the three kids I exclusively breastfed for 15, 19 and 13 months. They all self weaned, I've never used formula. And so I've just got this, this unique experience, my own personal experience, and how this all works. And I want to touch on something you said that it's everybody's feeding, I'll say feeding journeys, different. People use straight up formula, great do that. People do a combo version of it, great do that. Some people just breastfeed? Great do that. I'm not here to convince you how you should feed your child. But I know that there are a subset of parents and a number of women that want to go back to work and they want to be able to breastfeed, and they have this goal of something that they want to do for them for their child in their, you know, in their lives and in their situation. And if I can help those parents with the tactical like tips and tricks of how to do that, I've been there. I've done it, and I think I've yet to hear a story that I wasn't like, oh, yeah, that's right. I did that this one time. Here's how. Right so to be able to share this really, really unique experience that I've had, with as many parents as possible to help try to alleviate some of that stress that they might have? Because it is still like, yes, it's growing, that there's more women in the workplace. And yes, it's growing that we talk, we actually talk about breastfeeding, but there's still very much like a taboo culture to it. And there's so many women I've met that are there, they're only one, right mom never did it. So Mom's not there to teach you friends haven't had their babies yet. They don't know how to teach you. You're the only woman at work. The dudes aren't going to teach you right? So there's so many women that are just living on an island, trying to figure this out on their own and trying to struggle through it on their own. And pointing you don't have to. It's not rocket science. I will say that I'm not, I did not invent any of this advice. Like, yeah, it's not that special. But it's finding it and finding a place that's, you know, not a one off"I went on one trip to Florida this one time" mommy blog on the internet. You know, I want to have a community of people that, this is what they do. This is what we talked about. this as you know, yeah. Some of the confidence to be able to do it. So very, very, I think that's the engineer piece of me, like very tactical, okay, how do we do this? And being able to, I think, to the sustainability like, of your own well being, like, you can't do this and be stressed out about it. Yeah, I'm a firm believer that stress is the number one thing that impacts milk supply and stressing about your milk supply. It's going to hurt your milk supply, right. So if I can help alleviate some of that stress, like, not only is it going to boost your milk supply, but you also like it's just one less thing you have to worry about. So you can spend that energy and you can spend your mental bandwidth on literally anything else. Rather than storing breast milk in the freezer. Yeah. That's easy. Yeah.

Katie Kurpanek: 14:28

And, like you said, just the concept of having one less thing to worry about. I mean, I only have one child right now, and we're hoping to have more but in my first time parenting experience, oh my gosh, the newborn phase, the breastfeeding phase, all of that was so completely overwhelming for me, and I'm a researcher. I'm a person who like dives deep into the research. I tried to prepare myself as much as I could, you know, to the best of my bill. At reading and talking to people in my life and listening to podcasts and like, Okay, how do I best prepare myself for this transition into parenthood. And even with all of that, I felt so overwhelmed by so many things. And you know, the things I felt overwhelmed by might be different for other people, depending on their experience. But all of that to say, when you are already tried to navigate this, especially if it's your first time, and then if you all if you are a parent who has to go back to work, like you said, you went back in the first eight weeks and five weeks with your first two kiddos. That is not very much time. And for most people, I would say that they are going to really struggle having to navigate the overwhelm that they feel with everything else, and then trying to figure out how do I freeze my breast milk supply? How do I pump? How do I make this happen. And also, unfortunately, we don't live in a society, at least in America, in the United States that is currently set up to support that. I know way more work environments that are not friendly to breastfeeding parents, than I do know of work environments that are supportive. And I have friends who have had to leave their jobs because they weren't given time to go and pump or they didn't have a place to go in public. They there were all those logistics, you know, that they had to struggle through. So you wrote a blog post a while back that I really loved and it was talking about this woman named Teresa, and you were both on a work trip to China. And you talked about how she was navigating all of this in her first work trip away from her baby for the first time. And you by this point, were like a seasoned pro. And I would love to hear kind of that experience from you know, your, your lens and how you helped walk her through so many of the fears and the struggles that I think a lot of our listeners could relate to?

Jillian Rothe: 16:56

Yes. Oh my god, that was such a long I feel like that was maybe almost five years ago. I do I do remember it, it like to a point. And I've had a number of conversations Similarly, since and the thing that stands out the most like the beginning of the conversation is just this. It's almost like a like a terrified anxiety, this like crushing version of women that that after they get asked to go on a work trip. And babies only 3, 4, 6 months old, maybe even up to a year right. And they haven't traveled yet. So it's just this new thing. And especially like when you get closer to a year, it's probably less of a big deal. Because you're like, Well, I made it I can Yeah, quote unquote. But like when when it's four and six months old, and baby hasn't started food yet, right? There's nothing to supplement here. Don't use formula yet. It's just it's this. This fear I hear women start with and Theresa was the same that holy crap, how am I going to do this? Do I have to like sacrifice my job to be able to keep this personal goal that I have with my family? And thus begins like the work life Navigation, balance, integration, sway, whatever you want to call it, right? Can I have both? And so what we're where I go to, in my mind, easy default is in the tactical, it's the How to, Alright, let's get down to the details. Let's line up the dominoes and then just knock them down. It's a very non emotional conversation, saying, Okay, how long is your flight? What time does it leave? What cooler? Are you bringing? What ice? Are you bringing? What hotel are you staying at? Have you called the hotel? Can they check on things? And so it's just stepping through all of the pieces, mostly of what cooling capability is available to you. And route while you're there and coming back? And what's your supply? Like? Like? Are you having like, are you adjusted enough? Or do you over supply? How many ounces? Are we going to be bringing? Or milliliters if you know we were over there? Are you going to be bringing with you and figuring out okay, are you going to be gone for two days and we can keep it chilled because it's easier to transport it or you're going to be gone for four or five days. And we're going to need to talk about freezing it or shipping it or you know that kind of stuff. And so it really just gets into the tactical details of how do I help you just bring a cooler of liquid gold from point A to point B and potentially back. And, and it's a really fun shift to see. And that's the part that like makes my heart so happy doing this that you like just one like if I help one person do this. That's enough for me. And it's been really cool to have one a whole bunch. But to be able to see her go from Holy shit I'm gonna have to choose between my job and my child to Oh, I can I can do both of these things. And it's just it's just been really really cool. And even in the last couple of months, I talked to a woman that was going to Spain and I saw her posting some of the stuff on Instagram of like, Oh look at me putting you know my freezer flat and roll hotel freezer like ah I'm helping somebody go on a trip, and also bring milk back. And I had another woman, she's from Australia, and she was going up to Bali for 10 days, which is a long trip. But it was bringing the baby with and it was how to talk to TSA, and what can I bring? And what do I ask the hotel and, like, it's things like that of the logistics of not knowing what to say and who to say it to and just carrying a cooler around. So it's been, it's been super fun, and I absolutely love it.

Katie Kurpanek: 20:27

That's amazing, I would have no idea where to start personally like I, I can definitely relate to those feelings of overwhelm, not having an idea of of how to, you know, even create a checklist, like you're talking about all the dominoes to put into place, and then you just go through them all. I wouldn't even know you know, what's the checklist? Where do I start? And so I know like on your website, you have a blog, you have some like helpful resources for people, you know, go to places and everything for putting some of those tips and tricks together. But if you were to just share, like a few of your pro pumping tips here that you feel like are really important for listeners to take away what would those be?

Jillian Rothe: 21:10

So number one is probably knowing how long milk is good for. Right? So if it's fresh versus chilled versus frozen. And if you Google that on the internet, as a first time mom, you are going to get 1000 different answers because one of them is going to tell you that the guidelines are, one second school is calling, but I think

Katie Kurpanek: 21:35

feel free to take that

Jillian Rothe: 21:37

I think they're fine. Mom life doesn't stop. No, the first thing I would say is the milk storage guidelines. And so knowing fresh versus chilled versus frozen. And so fresh milk is good for hours, insert whatever number you want. Chilled milk is good for days, insert whatever number you want. And frozen milk is good for months. And so hours, days and months, just the simplicity of that and that goes for you being on the trip. And that goes for whatever caretakers back at home. Because they're gonna need to know how to feed baby while you're gone, if they're not coming with you. And so definitely, definitely know that there's there's guidelines that I post on my website, like it's easy for me to remember the same numbers. So two to four hours, two to four days, two to four months, four to eight months, you know kind of thing that it's just easy to use the same numbers, but know that they are guidelines. And I can give an anecdotal story like with even with my three kids. And it's me and my milk came from my body, it was different with all three kids in Singapore with the first one, I think if it went more than three days in the fridge, it was it was done. It was no good. And with my third one in the States, it was good for like, five, six days in the fridge. So even even your own supply with your own different children can change. So just know that it's a guideline and know that there's fresh chilled and frozen or kind of the breakdown for that. And so that's what comes into how long you're gonna be gone. How do I take care of it? So that's kind of the biggest one of making sure you know that.

Katie Kurpanek: 23:06

And were you just kind of trusting your gut when you you know, did you like open your container and smell your milk? Or like how did you kind of just know, this is bad this is you know, okay.

Jillian Rothe: 23:16

So it's milk. You'll know when it goes bad, I promise. Okay. Like, it smells different than like cow's milk, if you're used to that. And so try to, like, see what it tastes like, like fresh when it's coming out. It's actually very, very sweet. But like, if you're ever feeding a baby a bottle, maybe it's been three or four days in the fridge and they won't take it try it yourself. If it tastes a little bit sour. Probably went bad. You know, it's not going to hurt them. They're, they're fine. But that one's probably gone bad. And so that's it's kind of the trial and error method. There's that's the sneaky science behind it. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. It's like if you're a new parent, if you're like shit, I don't know. Yeah, then like, sacrifice like a half ounce to an ounce, put it in the fridge and just kind of smell it every day. Until it goes bad. Like you'll notice. Yeah, one versus that one that's been sitting there for a week and a half, like, yep, there it is. That's bad milk. And so like, what I what I've seen parents do is like fresh milk. I think most of them say like three to four hours on a counter, like out before you have to chill it. I would see people that it's four hours and 15 minutes in and they throw it away. No trying to, don't do that. Try it first. You know, see if it's really bad I mean, if it's been sitting out for a day and a half. Probably not good anymore. Yeah. But yeah, just try it out. Okay. You'll know, I promise.

Katie Kurpanek: 24:46

Awesome. Yeah, I love that just more, more empowering people to have the confidence have the ability to trust themselves. I think that's huge. Okay, so So remembering those hours, days and months and Then, what else? Do you have any other like pro pumping tips?

Jillian Rothe: 25:04

Yeah, like, go into it. I'm gonna say this because you know, I think it paints a picture, go into pumping and go into this schedule with the confidence and the intention of like, and if you're seeing a video, you got to stand up, shoulders back, think about your average white man on a plane and that spread that they just take up some space and I'm here and I know what I'm able to do, like, walk into it with that level of confidence. Walk up to the TSA agent, knowing that you can do this, walk up to scheduling with your boss, knowing that you can do this, like there are now thankfully, in the last few months, there are laws that protect most workers ability to pump at work. So like know that you get a break in your schedule. And so it's not going to your boss saying, Can I pump? It's going to your boss and saying I'm going to pump two times today, Is there a time that's most convenient for you? Or do we need to work this out? Or can I just handle this myself? Or going up to them and saying, Where is the lactation room? Not Do we have one? Mm hmm. Like so assume and know. And fake it till you make it a little bit if you don't, but this is something that's protected for you, most of you. I know. There's like a small subset of like hourly employees, and my heart goes out to nursing and teaching and those kinds of positions, it gets really, really difficult. But you should have the confidence and you should have the protections to be able to go do this, especially going through TSA, and especially going back to work. If there's somebody that tells you you can't they're probably the ignorant one of the conversation about that.

Katie Kurpanek: 26:44

Yeah. And that is amazing to even just be aware of that, I think it's so important to, again, dive into the research, that's at least what I prefer to do, and usually encourage people to do all the time is to research where you live, and what are you know, the the laws and the coverage that you have, so that you can be more empowered, and be more confident when you walk this out. And, like you said, the people who tell you that that's not provided for you or not, you know, available, then they're probably the ones who are ignorant. And, at least for me, that always helps me feel like I have a voice. Like, I know, I've done the research, I know that this is available. And I think that you know, that's huge, because a lot of times when you're already navigating the overwhelm of first time parenting or even just first time walking through, maybe you know you had kids before, but you didn't have to go back to work or didn't have the same circumstances. If this is your first time, then feeling like you have a voice here you have a say, and you are in control of your workspace and your breastfeeding journey. That's huge. I think not a lot of people feel like they have that. Yep,

Jillian Rothe: 28:01

yep. And it's new. And so the one the most recent one is called the pump act. If that's new, and you haven't heard of it, and you want to research on it, that's the new one. Most recently there was passed to help with pumping protections at work, which is which is amazing. Okay, I love like that stuff wasn't there when you know, my daughter was born eight years ago. So it was it was just finding, I've got some of the weirdest pictures of where I went and pumped and I was in Asia, right. So like going into Indonesia funny story. Like, I think the funniest place I had to go was, was a trip to Jakarta. And it's a male dominated construction industry. And like, Okay, I need to I need to go pump halfway through this, this meeting, and they had this room and it was smaller than like, a walk in closet. And there were four of us women sitting in there. And we're all just we're all just sitting pumping together. There wasn't like a pod, like your own little privacy, basically yeah, we're ripping them out. And this dude walked in like I guess he might not have known like what the room was just kind of walked in and goes oh shoot the wrong place turns around walks out you know but like there was there was some bonding over and it's one I won't forget.

Katie Kurpanek: 29:09

Oh my gosh, that's so funny. Yeah, you you've probably had a lot of interesting places to have to pump in and situations where it was not always convenient for you to pump because of all the traveling that you've done with work

Jillian Rothe: 29:23

I think my one of my most recent one was I had to be in a mine site. And I'm in a pickup truck with three other men and I'm like I'm sitting back guys are you guys want to like jam out to it? We can you know, whatever you want to do, but you just

Katie Kurpanek: 29:38

own it. You just own it. That's great.

Jillian Rothe: 29:41

I mean three kids in like, they're like elbows at this stage like it is not, it's just another accessory.

Katie Kurpanek: 29:53

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Jillian Rothe: 32:48

for both of us to remember cigarette lighters and cars. Yes, exactly.

Katie Kurpanek: 32:53

And plugging that in and I was like, you know, multiple times now I've I've had the experience of sitting in the front seat, and just pumping in the passenger seat as my husband's driving. And because you know, we couldn't always pull off depending on where we're going. And then you just store it in your cooler, which was sitting at the foot of my, my seat and that it worked. It was great.

Jillian Rothe: 33:15

I'll give you two upgrades to that. Okay, so on my website, I have a product called Techniice. And so instead of dry ice, it's actually, and this maybe goes into the sustainable one, instead of a one time use dry ice, it's actually a reusable form of dry ice.

Katie Kurpanek: 33:30

What How have I not heard of this?

Jillian Rothe: 33:32

It's an Australian product. And it's it's marketed almost exclusively to the fishing industry and people that use YETI Coolers. And so we found it when we were over there. I now import it to the states and sell it on my website. But it's like a reusable, like pliable. It's got all these little pods. And when you're done with it, you could stick it in the cooler and you put a bunch of sheets around it and it's going to stay colder longer than like those regular ice packs. Wow. And then you chuck in the freezer and refreeze it use it again.

Katie Kurpanek: 34:00

Oh my gosh, that's amazing. Yes.

Jillian Rothe: 34:02

So bring that instead. And I have that as like a How long does it last? I flew back from Brazil on a trip so it's 17 hours in route. I land in Detroit I have to switch you know go through security comeback. And the TSA agents like oh your your ice packs melted. Well, one of the little corner bits was melted. So I said okay, give me a scissors. I cut off that one that he was throwing a fit about with the rest of the back of the cooler. Wow, one little pod that had melted after 17 hours so like screw it, have it here you go. Yeah, so I don't have to throw out the whole thing. So yeah, Techniice is amazing. The other thing I absolutely bring with my road trips is a hand pump. And so if an AC adapter dies, if a battery dies, you've got the manual version of a pump and either bring one or two of those depending on how long the road trip is and then you don't even have to clean it until you get to where you're going. So I would do that like when I was traveling to like Manila, you know, there's no potable water like at your hands when you need it. And so I would bring two different hand pumps, use it one at a time for one session, and then three hours later use the other one. And no washing in between so have a hand pump with you in those situations, and then it's so much so much easier to use in a car, like real quickly.

Katie Kurpanek: 35:15

I bet yeah, that's amazing too. Because I mean, also there are going to be situations where you don't have access to, you know, the electricity. So if you're, you know, in that sort of situation, you're going to need a hand pump as well. And yeah, we totally did experience one time where like, we I don't know what happened, I think I like fried the battery or something. And so then we were in a bind, and we were trying to figure out what to do on the road. And we had to like, go stop into a Walmart. Anyway, that that sounds a lot more feasible. So I'm glad that we're learning this.

Jillian Rothe: 35:46

Yeah, I think a handpump's like 30, 40 bucks. at the very most. And then the other thing, we did a lap around Lake Michigan, because we're insane. And we had two small kids at the time. And so one of the things like we like if the bigger one is sleeping, and the little one wakes up and needs like just a snack, like a bottle snack, I would pump it, I would just sit in the back of the car, and I've got the two kids with me. And let that one keep sleeping. And this one wakes up. And so you'd pump in the car and then feed him real quickly while I'm sitting there while I'm watching him, you know, kind of thing, but we can just kind of keep moving. Yeah. And then you don't have to stop every like, two to three hours.

Katie Kurpanek: 36:25

Yeah, so now you've got a time saver and a sanity saver, because you don't have to deal with your crying children.

Jillian Rothe: 36:30

road trips are fun with babies.

Katie Kurpanek: 36:32

Oh, so much fun. Okay, these are amazing tips. And you okay, you mentioned part of what you sell on your website. So let's get into that for a little bit. Because I only really know a lot about one product that I am super jazzed about and you know, tell everybody about it that I can. But you have even more on your website. So I want to talk about the different tools that MAMMaway offers for or at least resources, you know, for sustainable breastfeeding journeys. And then we'll specifically talk about the Freeze It Flat because that is kind of like your, you know, top tool. It was the Yeah, it's like the award winning breast milk storage Product of the Year. Right in 2021?

Jillian Rothe: 37:19

2022, Okay, And if I could like fun fact. Humblebrag you're the you're the first one to know this. So here you go. I got an email this morning. We won 2023 as well.

Katie Kurpanek: 37:32

Yeah, that's so exciting. Congratulations. Yes.

Jillian Rothe: 37:35

Yeah. It's not gonna be like, totally across the internet yet. I gotta get my social media team in. But yeah, we got an email this morning. It was it was the Freeze It Flat was named the breast milk storage product of the year, two years in a row.

Katie Kurpanek: 37:46

Oh, my gosh, that's so exciting. Congratulations.

Jillian Rothe: 37:49

Thank you. Thank you.

Katie Kurpanek: 37:50

Yeah, that's amazing. Okay, I so let's talk about what the Freeze It Flat is for anybody who doesn't know. And then any of the other tools and resources that you got going on MAMMaway.

Jillian Rothe: 38:01

Yeah. So for the audio listeners, if you imagine an ice cream sandwich, and the breast milk is the ice cream, we make the cookies. So we make this outer bit that goes around it. I've heard other people describe it as a book. So if you imagine something closing around, we made kind of the cover of the book. And it's really a device that's meant to hold any breast milk bag, except for Willow, those ones don't work very well. But hold any breast milk bag, kind of squish it together. And then so it's these two plastic plates, and it's got these fancy silicone straps around kind of like fancy rubber bands to go around and and hold it together. And so the fancy new piece of it that's a little different than anything else that's out there is that it creates that compression. And so it squishes the bag completely flat while it's freezing. And so you can take one bag or two days at a time, jam it in next to the diner nuggets because you know reality. And it's going to come out flat every single time. So no more cookie sheet Jenga no more losing bags in the back of the freezer, no more having to sacrifice your entire freezer in order to like lay them all out. So you can cram it into whatever little space you have. And then the benefit of that is twofold. One, obviously being the space savings. So we found with bags like Medela or spectra that kind of like standup triangle bags, we get almost double the space where you would just laying them flat, which is huge for people that don't have the space for an extra deep freezer, or over suppliers that have an extra deep freezer. get half of it back. Yeah. Which is amazing. And then the secondary benefit we found kind of on accident because of some dork science behind how the bags break. And what we're finding is they're not breaking because it's the bag that's a problem. It's how the bag is handled. So you see people on the internet that are like oh I hate these bags because they break oh I love These bags because they don't. And it's the same bag. It's what it is. It's how it's been handled and how it's being frozen. And so when you're freezing it and compressing it uniformly, it doesn't expand the same. And so if you imagine if you ever frozen a water bottle, yeah, and you see how the top kind of pops off, milk does that too in a bag. And so if you're just laying it there, the skinny bit at the top is going to freeze first. And so when it goes to expand, it kind of blows out the bottom. Interesting. And that's usually where you're going to find the bags cracking. And so by freezing it like completely flat, you minimize a lot of that. And then the other piece of it when they're completely flat, and they're organized, and they're lined up, and they're not sliding all over the freezer. If you've ever taken two ice cubes and crammed them into each other, they break right like shouldn't do that. And so if you keep them organized, they're less likely to be sliding around running into each other and breaking. We're not spilling liquid gold anymore when we go to defrost it, which has been huge.

Katie Kurpanek: 41:01

Oh yeah. No more crying over spilled milk.

Jillian Rothe: 41:06

Exactly. Yes. crying over spilled milk has nothing to do with cows, I'm sorry.

Katie Kurpanek: 41:12

No, it's this liquid gold! You worked hard for that. Like, we definitely want to save as much as possible, obviously, and get that to good use. So that's amazing. I love the visual that you have on your Instagram one of the reels that you created with I think you're one of your children, and stacking doing like a stacking gang stacking game. Yeah, I guess. Yeah. Because I mean, it's just so fun to watch that like these are literally like completely flat bricks. And you can just stack one on top of the other, make this big old tower, it's not going anywhere, versus the bags that are just frozen the typical way that most people, oh, I just lay it flat. It's fine. Yes. No, like, they don't actually, they don't stack very well. It's a huge storage saver. So and then you said that it also works with, you know, almost all types of breast milk bags. So you can use the reusable kinds, which I think is also amazing, obviously, from an environmental standpoint, like if you don't want to use the single use throw away bags, I think that's awesome.

Jillian Rothe: 42:20

Yeah. And so fun fact, that's on my list of product development. Like I would love to have more products that are in that vein of saying, Okay, let's how do we get things that we can reuse that can that can be used with it. And obviously, if people are donating milk, you have to use the plastic ones. And, you know, that kind of thing, but definitely have some ideas around how to make that more sustainable. Yeah. Awesome. Those types. Yeah,

Katie Kurpanek: 42:46

I love it. I mean, I do say this all the time to you know, whoever I'm talking to, like, you can only do what you can do when you're trying to live sustainably if you don't have control over something, especially if it's like a systemic issue, then don't beat yourself up over that. But if everybody were actually trying to do their best, and doing the research and learning what kinds of tools are out there so that you can live more sustainably, that alone would make a huge, huge difference. So just do what you can do, you know, use the Freeze It Flat tool, use reusable bags if you have access to them. And that's great, feel feel better about taking care of the planet and

Jillian Rothe: 43:26

And Techniice! Yeah, definitely reusable there.

Katie Kurpanek: 43:29

Yeah. And then the Freeze It Flat itself, you also put a lot of thought into the engineering of that product and the sustainability of it from a material standpoint. So can you talk a little bit about that?

Jillian Rothe: 43:40

Yeah, from so like the original materials were like when we were prototyping was like, Okay, what's the cheapest thing we can find, you know, to be able to make this but as soon as we moved back to the States five years ago, and actually started making it, our first material if anybody's got the OG that's still out there somewhere. It was actually made from a recycled plastic company in Minnesota. So they would send us these sheets like big four by eight sheets of plastic that they would like compress recycled material, so it had this like matte finish to it. And then we had a 12 ton hydraulic press in our garage naturally as one would. And this like fancy cookie cutter that we were like punching them out ourselves in our garage was how we were originally making them. And so now we've evolved it to we've got a mold we're doing injection molding, which is like basically how most plastic pieces that you're you know, like lids for water bottle and Kid Toys and phone case covers, you know, most of the plastic things you see in us that are forms are made in an injection molding type of way. And so making that I wanted to make sure that I know my supply chain. And so we had the mold made its manufactured right here in Denver. I know my supplier, I want to know where things are coming from because I learned that some of the recycled quote unquote materials that come out of China, they'll make the water bottle on one side of the factory, chop it up, and then mold it into your product on the other side of the factory. And technically, that's recycled. Yeah, the the water bottle over here, and now they're using it over there. And I just I really did not want to have that I wanted to have like, somewhere close that I could see in touch and feel like I saw my mold, like we're doing some updates to some things. And I went up and visited like two three weeks ago. And yep, it was in the machine. And we were talking about it. And you know, so like, I want to have that relationship with my suppliers local. To know that, here's where things are coming from. There's two pieces of this that were very, very important to me with the plates is that I wanted to either be recycled material, or recyclable once they're done. And so right now the, so, apparently white plastic has to be virgin. So if you know anybody, or if there's somebody listening that knows how to get white materials that are recycled, I'm all yours. But yeah, that was one of the important things is making sure that you know when you're done with it, if you're not going to use it for leftovers, you can you can throw in a recycling bin.

Katie Kurpanek: 46:05

Okay, and using it for leftovers. So you're talking about taking like, you know, your baggies of food and freezing those black right? Yep. Yep. So same concept, same, you know, saving space in your refrigerator or freezer. Yeah, okay. Yeah, that's awesome.

Jillian Rothe: 46:23

So that was yeah, that was definitely important to me. The other piece, not from the product itself, but from the packaging. Is it like, especially having kids and Oh, my God, like the number of Amazon boxes and bags and kids, like the amount of packaging that people toss, or just accumulate? is just insane. And so it was a very intentional choice. And, yes, I know, it cost me more as a, you know, as a manufacturer, and I'm okay with that. So I made sure like, if Did you see our cardboard packaging that kind of goes around it? And the bands itself holds it together?

Katie Kurpanek: 46:56

I've seen it in your videos. Yes.

Jillian Rothe: 46:57

Yeah. So it's, it's not it's not fancy and that was on purpose. It was the most minimalist version of packaging that I could get. Because I don't think parents need more packaging in their lives. And so coming from my website, that's all you get, you get the little piece of cardboard that goes around it. It's in a, you know, a regular paper mailer. I don't use the bubble mailers. And then when it's going to Amazon, since it's going to be sitting in a warehouse for a while, you have to have it in some sort of poly kind of wrap. And so I use compostable bags for Amazon. And I make sure that, you know, I keep that inventory low enough and, and cycle through it. So there's not a compostable bag that disappears while it's sitting on the shelf for too long. I don't want the bad customer experience there. But yeah, that's a very intentional choice of like, okay, I need to make sure that this is this is sustainable. As much as I possibly can, especially as it's as the business was growing and, and figuring out how I can stay a sustainable manufacturer in a responsible manufacturer at scale, starting from day one.

Katie Kurpanek: 48:00

Yeah, I think that's incredible. And you are doing the most that you can do and, and it's evolving as your company grows, right. And the success of these tools grow, and you continue to create more products like you're dreaming about for the future. So I'm very excited to see that continue. And I just wish that more, you know, companies and CEOs and all that had the mindset of like being responsible for what happens with their products and their packaging and the whole deal. So I think that's such an inspiration. Yeah.

Jillian Rothe: 48:31

And then we were talking about like, what can we print on the inside? Like I was considering putting on the inside of the cardboard, like a like when I get it printed have like a coloring picture on the cardboard give it to your toddler to help them keep busy while you're on, you're feeding the baby. Love that little things like that. It's like, okay, how do I you know, make this have literally everything in here have a second life of some kind, even if it's five minutes to keep a toddler busy. You know, while you're getting some done. Yeah.

Katie Kurpanek: 48:59

I mean, the Amazon boxes that we've gotten recently, I've been cutting those up and creating little games out of the cardboard squares. So anything that can have a double purpose in life and keep my toddler entertained for a little bit is highly appreciated. So I think that is a wonderful idea.

Jillian Rothe: 49:17

How old is your toddler again?

Katie Kurpanek: 49:19

He's two and a half.

Jillian Rothe: 49:21

Okay, so I've mine are four, six and eight. What has been your most like, sustainable like, with kids? accomplishment, like banging your chest? Check out how badass I am because I did this thing and I did it with a small human.

Katie Kurpanek: 49:38

Oh, that's a great question. Um, I think it's probably diving into EC or Elimination Communication. So have you heard much about it?

Jillian Rothe: 49:51

No, teach me, okay.

Katie Kurpanek: 49:53

Yes. So it is all about like, basically early potty training. So Um, my two and a half year old Currently, he is fully potty trained, and he still wears a diaper to go to sleep. But that's only because it's me who's holding him back. Like he could wear underwear, he wears underwear the rest of the day. He could go to sleep and underwear. If I let him right now, I just personally am not ready yet to deal with like, middle of the night accidents and losing sleep over it, which I know is a totally selfish thing. But that's the you know, we're still holding on to diapers. And for that reason, and we've been using cloth diapers as well for the process. We didn't start elimination communication from birth. There are totally people who do that from like,

Jillian Rothe: 50:41

Now that you say it, I have seen it!

Katie Kurpanek: 50:43

Yeah, yeah, like holding their newborn babies over like a tiny potty. I do have a version of that tiny potty and I tried when he was a newborn. But being like I said earlier, being that overwhelmed first time mom, I was like, I had done so much research going into it, I thought I was going to be a pro. And then I tried when he was a newborn. And I was like freaking myself out thinking that I was like going to drop him or something. So I stopped. I do have all the you know, the tools, the tiny potty, I'm going to try again, the next time around if we have another baby. But anyway, we went back to elimination communication when he was older. So we tried it a little bit when he was like, I think six months old. But we really committed to it when he was 15 months old. So we've been using cloth diapers the whole time before. And, and I felt good about that sustainable choice as well. But then when he was 15 months old, we started the process of official like early potty training, I used all the elimination communication techniques I had read about and learned. And by the time he turned two, so my kids like nine months later, he was fully potty trained and has been since and it has been such a game changer not only for my own sense of like personal sustainability and not having to deal with like changing a poopy diaper. It is the best thing in the world. Because when he goes on the potty, it is way easier to just clean him up. And like there's really no mess. So that's been amazing and then not having to deal with like as much cloth diapering or disposable diapers. It's been like way more environmentally friendly. So I've been super, super proud of that accomplishment.

Jillian Rothe: 52:33

That's awesome. And I'm laughing because so I'm solo parenting all three of them this week. So like, this morning's chaos was my four year old is in a phase where he doesn't like to clean himself up. Yeah, he'll stand outside the bath. And then it's a downward dog. You know, as soon as you walk in, Yep. Yep, there you are. All of you. So we're in that phase right now. Yeah. And then so we've got him and both of my boys. We've got these. Have you seen the Pee Pants? The overnight Pee Pants? Yeah. Uh huh. We're trying that version of it. Like trying to wean off of diapers overnight. Yeah, both of them are totally fine during the day. But yeah, overnight is we're we're, we're we're trying to,

Katie Kurpanek: 53:21

it's hard. It's really hard. I mean, I guess like, you just have to be prepared to lose some sleep over it. And I'm just not there yet.

Jillian Rothe: 53:28

We do have we have the crib mattress. So maybe the hack for that we've got the crib mattress that's has like a plasticky kind of cover. Okay, we leave in our bedroom with a sheet on it with a pillow next to it. So like if there is an overnight accident, they can just like, come in our room and sleep on that bed, and then we can deal with sheets in the morning. Smart. Yeah, that's a good idea. Especially right? Like I can't. Yeah,

Katie Kurpanek: 53:53

seriously, it's like we you just got to sleeping through the night. You know? And like, I don't want to sacrifice that. Just kidding. Oh, my gosh, but then I know, by the time if we do have a second one that it's like, well, we're gonna have to deal with not sleeping through the night anyway. So maybe we'll just tackle it, then.

Jillian Rothe: 54:10

That's fine.

Katie Kurpanek: 54:12

Oh, my gosh, it has been so wonderful talking with you and just relating to you as a working parent. So I always wrap up every episode with the same question asking for one to three actionable steps about whatever we're talking about. So for you considering where all of our listeners could be tuning in from and what they might have access to as far as resources goes, could you share 1, 2, or 3 actionable steps they could take as soon as today to just empower them to find a sustainable balance in their working breastfeeding journey. It could be the same things you've shared just reemphasized or something brand new, what would you want to wrap up with?

Jillian Rothe: 54:53

So I would say like the biggest thing for me is the empowerment and confidence. Right? So if you are actively Pregnant, if you are actively planning to pump if you are actively like in that like, second, third, fourth fifth trimester stage of life, start getting educated sooner rather than later. If you don't know where to start, like, please reach out to me on Instagram, it's me. As a small solopreneur it's me, you're gonna get me. Maybe my social media team, but mostly me. So so look it up, really figure out what your options are, figure out the logistics early, so you don't have to be stressed going into it. And you can learn this kind of stuff. Long before you need it. So you don't have to be coming up on oh my gosh, I go back to work in two weeks, what the hell do I do. And so there is a community of people that are here to support that for you at all. I mean, there's not an income limit on, you know, sending a DM on Instagram, I want to help I want to help people do that. I would say the second one is, you know, probably the shameless plug of like, if you if you're out and about and you can use something like Techniice, that's part of why I brought it here is because I didn't see it in the states widely used. And so get like, just pick one or two things like especially having kids, like it's, it's a shit show. Be honest, we're all in it together. Like don't, you don't have to boil the ocean, you don't have to do everything, but like, one small thing that you can do. And, you know, for me that's trying to use reusable things with kids that they can use more than once. You know, so try to pick something and be be kind to your own sanity that doesn't have to be perfect, progress is progress is better than perfection. And if there's anything I can do to help with that, you know where to find me.

Katie Kurpanek: 56:42

Ah, I love all of that, you are amazing and you have created so many different ways to empower parents and I'm so thankful for what you're doing we're gonna have all of the contact information for you in the episode description. So if people click on that they'll find ways to contact you your Instagram, the MAMMaway website of course. And then also if if people are interested, you know any listeners who want to get the Freeze It Flat tool like right now or anything else that Jillian mentioned, you can click the link that's in the episode description. That's also my personal affiliate link with MAMMaway so then you'll be supporting two mama owned businesses because it will support Jillian of course, and then it will give me a small kickback for my business which comes at no extra cost to the listeners and and then there's a discount in there for you too. So I'm very excited to continue empowering people to live sustainably and as well as what you're doing, Jillian, thank you so much for being on the show today.

Jillian Rothe: 57:44

Thank you so much for having me. I love what you're doing. Keep it up.

Katie Kurpanek: 57:51

I hope you enjoyed today's episode, and if you did, I would love it if you would share it with a friend. Spread the word over your social media, or simply leave a review wherever you subscribe to this podcast to help others find it as well. Thank you so much for being here. I'll catch you next time.